Gear selection trouble

[magsmagsmags]

right tried this over at 400greybike and the general thought is that its a strip down the motor job, but i figured i'd get a second opinion on it before i do more harm than good. Here's the problem anyway...

having a bit of trouble selecting gears sometimes, this happens more frequently when the bike is cold but it still happens too much for my liking when the bike is warm.

The problems hard to explain, it has a couple of different issues, for a start sometimes when slowing down to change into first it will click into neutral instead. Other times it will go into first, but as i pull away it will jump into neutral and just rev and not move. a similar thing happens when changing up, more often that not the bike prefers to go into neutral than second.

At first this was just an annoyance, but it seems to be getting worse and is at the point where i'll go to pull away and lose my balance and nearly come off due to no power. I've tried adjusting the clutch but no luck, also played around with the gear lever with no luck.

aaand now its gotten worse, i'll be changing down gears and there's just nothing there, the pedal is completely slack.

The part i've been told could be the culprit is the de-tense spring? this means nothing to me and i've no idea what it is

opinions please

[sweekster]

From how you explained it, it sounds to me like your clutch is slipping. You probably just need a new clutch pack and springs. Here's an example of what you'll need:

Clutch Discs

Springs

The OEM equivalent to the above can also be obtained from your local Stealership along with a replacement detent arm and spring.

Hope that helps.

[magsmagsmags]

Hmmm doesn't seem like clutch slipping, i thought the usual sign for this is when you're in gear and rev, the revs go up and and speed doesn't. Meaning the clutch is still partly engaged when it shouldn't be?

[cad600]

I would try a new shift dent arm from Factory Pro. Factory Pro

It uses a larger roller bearing and stiffer spring to help aid in more precise shifts. You will need to remove the clutch pack to get to this.

[aaronb]

my gears were playing up after my bike had been sat for a while, someone said that it could be stuck because of the oil had settled.

[Model192]

I adjusted the clutch to make my neutral finding easier. Take the case off where the chain is and try that, it's the little screw.

Also change the oil if it's old.

I also know that most FZRs don't like going into first while moving quickly.

[DonTZ125]

I was thinking dogs, forks and drum, but this comment near the end of the post - "its gotten worse, i'll be changing down gears and there's just nothing there, the pedal is completely slack" - can be nothing but the detent spring.

Get the FP arm and spring, as recommended; everything I've read says it makes a world of difference. When you're ready, pull the fairings, drain the oil, pull the right side cover. Lay the bike down on some cardboard boxes or blankets (or not, if you don't care about scratches ) Pull the oil pan. Replace your detent arm; inspect your shift drum and forks, and gear dogs.

[magsmagsmags]

Yea someone else had suggested the spring
do i need the cog that someone else linked earlier too?

and i live in the UK, does that shop ship here or does anyone know where its available here?

[DonTZ125]

Not sure what 'cog' was linked to earlier - here's what CAD600 was pointing at:

http://www.factorypro.com/products/shif ... y_Pro.html (the FP site has lots of interesting stuff, but is absolute crap to navigate quickly or link to).

Your engagement dogs between 1st and 2nd could be shot, along with the shift forks, the shafts they ride on, and the cam that guides them. The detent spring is the quick and easy fix; the FP arm is a neat upgrade while your replacing parts in that area.

If the new spring and arm don't fix the issue, then you're into a serious teardown and some hard parts.

[cad600]

If you are talking about the star that is at the end of the shift drum, they are not replaceable on Yamaha's. You would only be getting spring, dent arm, and clutch cover gasket. Like DonTZ125 was saying though, this is a good time to inspect the rest of the transmission parts. reason is that if any of them are messed up, the shift kit will not solve the problem.

[magsmagsmags]

I just need to have a look i guess
Is it easy to strip it down far enough to check the detent spring / arm?

as i'm sure you can tell i'm not entirely sure what i'm doing having not owned my bike for long or had experience with mechanics.

[cad600]

It is not too bad to do. You need to drain the oil out and remove the clutch case cover. You should then be able to see the dent arm. To remove it though you will need to remove the clutch basket which starts to get involved.

But you may not be able to tell anything by looking at the dent arm. It is small and doesn't look like much anyway.

[the_finch]

I would try a new shift dent arm from Factory Pro. Factory Pro

It uses a larger roller bearing and stiffer spring to help aid in more precise shifts. You will need to remove the clutch pack to get to this.

And you will need to remove the oil pump as well. Don't try to take it out without removing the oil pump, you'll just make a mess of things like I did. Here's some pics from where I replaced the one on my '97 FZR600:
Clutch cover removed.

Clutch assembly removed

The socket is on the bolt you have to remove to replace the detent arm.

This picture is a little deceiving. On the left is the Factory Pro Detent arm assembly, but the one on the right is not actually stock. It's either an older factory pro kit or a stock part off of a newer bike.

Close-up of the detent arm trying to hide behind the shifter racheting mechanism and the oil pump.


The only downside to the Factory pro detent arm kit is that it makes it harder to find neutral, but that's good as well, as it makes it harder to false shift into neutral while accellerating or decellerating.

Another option is to just get rid of the bike and get a newer one. If you decide to go that route, I'll gladly come over and haul it away for you.

[magsmagsmags]

Great thanks for the advise, one more question, i presume it would be a good idea to order a gasket before i start? as i imagine there's a gasket between the cover. And also just to check, do i need to drain the oil before i remove the cover? or is it only necessary if i'm actually going to replace it

[the_finch]

Great thanks for the advise, one more question, i presume it would be a good idea to order a gasket before i start? as i imagine there's a gasket between the cover. And also just to check, do i need to drain the oil before i remove the cover? or is it only necessary if i'm actually going to replace it

The "shift kit" detent arm kit comes with a clutch cover gasket, so you won't need to order one if you're installing the kit. If you are planning on just pulling the cover, I'd try to have a gasket on hand first. My gasket was "okay", but a little questionable when I pulled the cover off (so I replaced it), but mine's a '97 with 23k miles.