FZRSupport: the FZROnline Archive

well it you look in the WIKI there is a new DIY carb synch tool designed & made and written up by Fizzer6Hundred.
Thank you for the time & effort you put into this and for sharing it with the rest of us

Link please, personally i don't think this method is proven, infact far from effective, sorry but Fizzer6hundred is a first time carb syncher

HAS he successfully synchronised his carbs yet? NOPE

mawler wrote:Link please

http://www.fzronline.com/wiki/doku.php? ... synch_tool

mawler wrote:Link please, personally i don't think this method is proven, infact far from effective, sorry but Fizzer6hundred is a first time carb syncher

HAS he successfully synchronised his carbs yet? NOPE

I think it'll work fine. It's really just a cheaper, DIY version of one of these:

http://www.revzilla.com/product/motion- ... carb-tuner

The only way it could really get better is if Fizzer6hundred's tool used four individual dial vacuum gauges.

blensen wrote:
The only way it could really get better is if Fizzer6hundred's tool used four individual dial vacuum gauges.

I definitely do not want to fuel debate, but in the late 80's, as a kawi tech, we were strongly advised not to use gauge type manometers. It was proven to Kawi at the time that the degree of error was significantly greater than that of conventional mercury types-- all this despite the fact that the manuals actually referred to the "Kawi Special tool Gauge Mano"! Now, that being said, times may have changed, but the guys at my shop still use mercury tools, or the new carbtune ones (with metal rods instead of mercury).

Logically, the only way to test the accuracy of any home-made device is to synchronize your carbs with one, then switch the tubes to different ports and try again...-- the device should still show them as being synchronized. If it doesnt, then you need to build in a margin of error by trying all 4 on all 4 different ports. Some gauges have fine adjustment screws on the back for calibration, but most dont.

IN the simple mercury style tools, all 4 matched tubes draw mercury from the same rez, which has only vent hole. The only variation could possibly be a blockage in the tube, or variation in the I/D of the tube.

kiki231 wrote:

blensen wrote:
The only way it could really get better is if Fizzer6hundred's tool used four individual dial vacuum gauges.

I definitely do not want to fuel debate, but in the late 80's, as a kawi tech, we were strongly advised not to use gauge type manometers. It was proven to Kawi at the time that the degree of error was significantly greater than that of conventional mercury types-- all this despite the fact that the manuals actually referred to the "Kawi Special tool Gauge Mano"! Now, that being said, times may have changed, but the guys at my shop still use mercury tools, or the new carbtune ones (with metal rods instead of mercury).

Logically, the only way to test the accuracy of any home-made device is to synchronize your carbs with one, then switch the tubes to different ports and try again...-- the device should still show them as being synchronized. If it doesnt, then you need to build in a margin of error by trying all 4 on all 4 different ports. Some gauges have fine adjustment screws on the back for calibration, but most dont.

IN the simple mercury style tools, all 4 matched tubes draw mercury from the same rez, which has only vent hole. The only variation could possibly be a blockage in the tube, or variation in the I/D of the tube.

Yamaha had the same Philosophy , I have a set of meters here BUT they have the adjustments.
I i had a place to keep it safe from the brats i would have the equivalent of mercury stacks

Ok so the Manometer works well. It gave me enough time to realize #2 is pulling way more vacuum than the rest of the cylinders. So I had to shut it down lest oil gets sucked up into the carb.

Does anyone realise, if that oil gets sucked into the cylinder what damage IT WOULD CAUSE?

Bent con rods, flattened big end bearings

Maybe a restrictor/damper could work. MY Morgan Carbtune has them, and no oil either.

mawler wrote:

Ok so the Manometer works well. It gave me enough time to realize #2 is pulling way more vacuum than the rest of the cylinders. So I had to shut it down lest oil gets sucked up into the carb.

Does anyone realise, if that oil gets sucked into the cylinder what damage IT WOULD CAUSE?

Bent con rods, flattened big end bearings

Maybe a restrictor/damper could work. MY Morgan Carbtune has them, and no oil either.

That's why I went with the 2 bottle system. And when I went to put in my liquid I used AT fluid and took one of the bottles and only filled it 3/4 full. So when I put half into the other bottle there would be no way the vacuum could push the liquid into the engine. But even it did it wouldn't matter a whole lot since it was AT fluid. Just my 2 cents.

Chris.

Chris if any oil/atf gets sucked into the cylinders @ 1200 rpm,

Did anyone ever write up the two bottle construction with a material list ?

Mal I will put a warning about NOT letting oil get sucked in .Then perhaps you can smile & relax :-}

no need to panic guys on oil being sucked in-- you need a serious volume of oil to cause hydraulic lock-- and thats the only threat, oil will all burn off.
Avoiding this problem is the whole reason we warm up our bikes before synchronizing the carbs- so that after hooking up the tool, you can start it , and it goes right to idle. In fact you should should confirm/set warm idle speed prior to doing the work.

I would think that all of us would shut the engine off if they saw their fluid being sucked in. Sure some would get in, but not very much. I think the combustion chambers are something like 15 cubic cm (guessing 10:1 compression on a 150ml cylinder), thats a lot of oil -- on one stroke!

I have had mercury from my 'motion pro" sucked in several times, and all i did was take the bike for a ride to burn it out (there is a whole section in my instructions about this)

i now use the beautiful Carbtune one from the UK-- it uses metal rods that cannot be sucked in-- it is a dream.

yamaha_george wrote:Did anyone ever write up the two bottle construction with a material list ?

I had not seen a write up on them. I followed the link in the wiki to the Kawi forum and built the bottle type. I'm using ATF fluid so that I can see it easily. It is a 2 bottle model so I have to do Cylinder 1 & 2 then switch to 3 & 4 then match 2 with 3 and I'm done. I normally have to do this twice. The first time gets me very close, then I take a trip up the road to see how it turned out. If anything, I have to do this one more time just to fine tune it. It works great and sense I had a YZF600 tank, it wasn't a big deal to do it. Only took 30 minutes including time to remove the tank. But then again I also use an axillary fuel bottle going into the fuel pump so I'm able to get the tank out of the way completely.

One thing I made sure to do is to only put enough ATF fluid in so that if I get way off the fluid will only flow into the second bottle and not up the tube into the carb. Here is a picture of the set up I built.













The only difference between what you would do for FZR and YZF 600 carbs is the carb boot connector. The YZF600 uses a double ended barb to go into the tube. The FZR600 will use a connector that has a single barb and a screw to connect to the carb boot.

I like the OP method to make a single unit to do all 4 carbs at one time. I didn't have the patients to do this, but it should be possible even with the bottle method. It will be really big though.

I would do a write up, but it has been so long since I built this that I can not remember the exact sizes of the materials.

cad600 wrote:I would do a write up, but it has been so long since I built this that I can not remember the exact sizes of the materials

It's all pretty much there. I will throw in. It's 1/4 ID 3/8 OD tubing. 2 Bottles of your choice. I used gold peak tea. And then 2 stoppers that fit the bottles. All this is found at lowes.

As for the parts that are specific to the FZR that go to the carb tips. I used 6mm grease fittings from Autozone for a while but you will have to zip tie the tubing onto them. Or go out to a mig welding shop and get .45 tips for a welder. The threads are the same but they don't go nearly as far into the carb boot.

Also I didn't use the fittings in the stoppers, I just drilled holes in the stoppers and put the tubbing into the stoppers. Made sure it didn't pinch the tubing.
Chris.

yamaha_george wrote:Did anyone ever write up the two bottle construction with a material list ?

Does this count?
viewtopic.php?f=32&t=2950

This is listed in the WIKI but the same procedures apply
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/How_do_I_s ... uretors%3F

My two bottle synch tool isn't as nice as Cad's but it did the job

I like using Sobe bottles for my 2 bottle tool. I usually fill one bottle about 3/4 full with brake fluid (its what I have the most of on hand), then split it into both bottles. Ive used the hell out of it and never had a problem will potential fluid in the engine danger, even at higher RPMs with WAY out of synch carbs. The 2 bottle method is crude and not very exact, but IMO it beats paying a shop to do it with the right tool. I wouldnt mind having a nice synch tool of my own on hand, but for the street riding I do, the 2 bottle setup works great. I like bang for your buck, and this tool usually just costs me the price of 2 sobe bottles .

The 4 tube manifold setup looks like it would be a bit more precise, but it looks like it would have significant more danger of sucking fluid into the engine.