Hi,
Got an 88 fzr 1000 that I will start working on soon.
With only 4200 miles on it, it's in pretty bad shape.
Removed the carbs yesterday and could see some water standing inside.
I am yet to drain the oil.
Anything I should do about the water and potential damage? Like dump some oil in?
I will take engine out at some point and open it, but wanted to see if there is anything I can do to soak it in the meantime.
Water through carbs
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willandrip
- Level 7.0
- Posts: 704
- Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2012 11:51 am
- Location: TYNE AND WEAR -UNITED KINGDOM
Re: Water through carbs
Blow or mop the water out of the inlets...drain the oil BEFORE churning on with the starter or attempting to run it.
If oil has water in it...all you will do is emulsify it by turning engine and oil pump over...then it takes ages and many oil changes to remove the emulsification.
If the oil is reasonably fresh then reuse it for the briefest time just to test the engine THEN replace the oil and filter.
If water is in the oil...discard, drain thoroughly, and replace .
If oil has water in it...all you will do is emulsify it by turning engine and oil pump over...then it takes ages and many oil changes to remove the emulsification.
If the oil is reasonably fresh then reuse it for the briefest time just to test the engine THEN replace the oil and filter.
If water is in the oil...discard, drain thoroughly, and replace .
Sent from my keyboard using the English language not some teen text shite from a fooking phone.
Re: Water through carbs
Thanks man.
Bike is far from running or even a first start attempt. And there is no rush. Carbs need a good cleaning first.
I'll drain the oil tonight and see what's going on. Still need to worry about any damage cause by water or was it sealed and I might be lucky?
Just got the bike two weeks ago and have no info on its history.
Mainly bought it for all the parts that came with it to complete my 750. But it's a good base for a custom build, so I'm looking forward to that.
Bike is far from running or even a first start attempt. And there is no rush. Carbs need a good cleaning first.
I'll drain the oil tonight and see what's going on. Still need to worry about any damage cause by water or was it sealed and I might be lucky?
Just got the bike two weeks ago and have no info on its history.
Mainly bought it for all the parts that came with it to complete my 750. But it's a good base for a custom build, so I'm looking forward to that.
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willandrip
- Level 7.0
- Posts: 704
- Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2012 11:51 am
- Location: TYNE AND WEAR -UNITED KINGDOM
Re: Water through carbs
If it has stood anywhere where water can enter the inlets then it will have already adsorbed water vapour that then condensed into at least one cylinder.
It is the nature of how a 4 cylinder engine comes to rest that one valve is always open and the pistons are two fully up and 2 fully down.
This means one cylinder gets corroded over time and a compression test reveals 3 good high comp cylinders and one a good bit lower.
Its something many owners contend with.
Any engine should be run regularly or properly mothballed if left for long periods if cylinder condition is to be retained.
If the oil is half full of water you should be able to see through the sight glass.
In that case damage may have occurred to bottom half bearings and gearbox.
This level of water ingress should be immediately apparent.
The inlet you noticed water in is sealed..if not then unless that valve is open and the exhaust valve is closed and the whole engine is full right up to the level you saw in that cylinder then it will be ok.
It is the open inlet valve tract cylinder you need to worry about.
It is the nature of how a 4 cylinder engine comes to rest that one valve is always open and the pistons are two fully up and 2 fully down.
This means one cylinder gets corroded over time and a compression test reveals 3 good high comp cylinders and one a good bit lower.
Its something many owners contend with.
Any engine should be run regularly or properly mothballed if left for long periods if cylinder condition is to be retained.
If the oil is half full of water you should be able to see through the sight glass.
In that case damage may have occurred to bottom half bearings and gearbox.
This level of water ingress should be immediately apparent.
The inlet you noticed water in is sealed..if not then unless that valve is open and the exhaust valve is closed and the whole engine is full right up to the level you saw in that cylinder then it will be ok.
It is the open inlet valve tract cylinder you need to worry about.
Sent from my keyboard using the English language not some teen text shite from a fooking phone.
Re: Water through carbs
Thanks so much for the info.
I will drain the oil and see what is going on.
Since the engine only has 4200 miles on it, I really hope nothing major is wrong with it.
I will drain the oil and see what is going on.
Since the engine only has 4200 miles on it, I really hope nothing major is wrong with it.
Re: Water through carbs
Took a pic...
Re: Water through carbs
Drained the oil. Got a big surprise...
My drain pan that holds 7 quarts/6.6 litres is completely full.
That's twice as much oil as should be in there.
Oh dear, this is going to be fun... don't even want to know what else is wrong
My drain pan that holds 7 quarts/6.6 litres is completely full.
That's twice as much oil as should be in there.
Oh dear, this is going to be fun... don't even want to know what else is wrong
Re: Water through carbs
Sure that its all oil and not oil mixed up with fuel? If fuel is inside the oil, the you should check the swimmer-valve for wear as fuel might have passed the valve and entered the combustion chamber (and during time also passed the piston-rings and entered the oilsump)...
"The social dynamics of the net are a direct consequence of the fact that nobody has yet developed a Remote Strangulation Protocol." -- Larry Wall
Want Pics? Then have a look at my galleries...different topics: Bike and Car restauration, exhibitions, Trackdays (no, not me on the Track until now), carneval in cologne, other things..
Want Pics? Then have a look at my galleries...different topics: Bike and Car restauration, exhibitions, Trackdays (no, not me on the Track until now), carneval in cologne, other things..
Re: Water through carbs
Didn't smell fuel at all, but maybe over time smell goes away? Tank was removed, but not sure how long ago.
Oil was pretty thin, so fuel could be possible. No water though.
By swimmer valve, what do you mean? Floats inside the carbs? If so, the fuel "should" drain to outside, no?
Oil was pretty thin, so fuel could be possible. No water though.
By swimmer valve, what do you mean? Floats inside the carbs? If so, the fuel "should" drain to outside, no?
Re: Water through carbs
Jepp, floater-needle and floater-valveseat inside the floaterchamber of the carbs were the parts i meaned (i'm not a native english-speaker, so sorry for my direct translation as these parts in german are named "Schwimmerventilnadel" and "Schwimmerventilsitz" )...if these don't close properly the fuel drains to the pistons in the combustion chaber and during time goes by, the fuel passes the piston rings and drains into the crankcase and there it will mix up with the oil if the motor is turned once ... if the motor was not turned (even not passively) then it might stay separated above the oil for some time and it would have been easier to get it out there with a small hose,once mixed up it will take up to several months to let it getting separated again by its own...
)...if these don't close properly the fuel drains to the pistons in the combustion chaber and during time goes by, the fuel passes the piston rings and drains into the crankcase and there it will mix up with the oil if the motor is turned once ... if the motor was not turned (even not passively) then it might stay separated above the oil for some time and it would have been easier to get it out there with a small hose,once mixed up it will take up to several months to let it getting separated again by its own..."The social dynamics of the net are a direct consequence of the fact that nobody has yet developed a Remote Strangulation Protocol." -- Larry Wall
Want Pics? Then have a look at my galleries...different topics: Bike and Car restauration, exhibitions, Trackdays (no, not me on the Track until now), carneval in cologne, other things..
Want Pics? Then have a look at my galleries...different topics: Bike and Car restauration, exhibitions, Trackdays (no, not me on the Track until now), carneval in cologne, other things..
Re: Water through carbs
Dude, you're German?
Ich auch, lebe aber in NY seit 10 Jahren.
Ah, hab es gerade in deinem Profil gesehen. D'oh.
Better keep it in English though in case someone is reading this thread.
Ich auch, lebe aber in NY seit 10 Jahren.
Ah, hab es gerade in deinem Profil gesehen. D'oh.
Better keep it in English though in case someone is reading this thread.
Re: Water through carbs
I guess its better for the audience to stay at english here in the forums threads, too...might be confusing to jump between different languages, especially if someone switches to languages with asian or cyrillic characters (or maybe hieroglyphs? 
)... Theres a small chance to test it easily if its fuel inside the mixture or not: take a few drips of the mixture, put it in an ashtray and try to burn them with a fireligter,if its burning rapidly, its obviously fuel mioxed inside the oil as oil takes longer time to get it burning...but beware, only take some drips as you don't want to get a burst of it or burn your environment
"The social dynamics of the net are a direct consequence of the fact that nobody has yet developed a Remote Strangulation Protocol." -- Larry Wall
Want Pics? Then have a look at my galleries...different topics: Bike and Car restauration, exhibitions, Trackdays (no, not me on the Track until now), carneval in cologne, other things..
Want Pics? Then have a look at my galleries...different topics: Bike and Car restauration, exhibitions, Trackdays (no, not me on the Track until now), carneval in cologne, other things..
Re: Water through carbs
Well, at this point it probably doesn't matter anymore.
It's just a shame because the engine has only 4200 miles on it and I was hoping it would be in better shape.
I'll let her sit for a while put new oil in, see if she turns over by hand and then crank her. Let's see what happens. I have a spare engine anyway, just in case.
Or maybe I'll take the engine out and open it up to see what's going on first. Need to take it out anyway to have everything painted at some point.
It's just a shame because the engine has only 4200 miles on it and I was hoping it would be in better shape.
I'll let her sit for a while put new oil in, see if she turns over by hand and then crank her. Let's see what happens. I have a spare engine anyway, just in case.
Or maybe I'll take the engine out and open it up to see what's going on first. Need to take it out anyway to have everything painted at some point.
Re: Water through carbs
Do you have access to an endoscopic camera? If yes,just get it and have a look inside the combustionchamber through the sparkplug-holes. If theres (nearly) no corrosion visible inside the chamber, then theres a good chance for running the motor with a smooth run when fresh oil in the correct amount ist filled in and the first turns of the crankshaft are done by hand (just for getting the oil pumped to the correct places without at first dry running under a little load)...
Edit: Some drips of fresh oil inside the combustionchamber before turning the motor might be a good idea,too..only to get the oil drips to the pistonrings for a smoother slide at the first turns
Edit: Some drips of fresh oil inside the combustionchamber before turning the motor might be a good idea,too..only to get the oil drips to the pistonrings for a smoother slide at the first turns
"The social dynamics of the net are a direct consequence of the fact that nobody has yet developed a Remote Strangulation Protocol." -- Larry Wall
Want Pics? Then have a look at my galleries...different topics: Bike and Car restauration, exhibitions, Trackdays (no, not me on the Track until now), carneval in cologne, other things..
Want Pics? Then have a look at my galleries...different topics: Bike and Car restauration, exhibitions, Trackdays (no, not me on the Track until now), carneval in cologne, other things..
Re: Water through carbs
Yes, good idea. I have a camera like that.
Gonna finish up the other bike first (side fairings are left) so I can move the problem bike on my table lift. Makes it a bit easier.
Gonna finish up the other bike first (side fairings are left) so I can move the problem bike on my table lift. Makes it a bit easier.